Join the Conversation

This is a quick note to welcome our many new readers to the Bible Design and Binding Blog. The message of this blog is, You are not alone! There are people out there who share your obsessive interest in quality and aesthetics, and this is where they hang out. Read the reviews and blog posts, but most importantly be sure to check out the comments threads, where people with much more insight than I have are freely sharing it. I want to thank everyone who has contributed to the dialogue, and encourage those of you who are just lurking to jump right in. This is a place to have your questions answered, so ask away!

Comments

[ElShaddai Edwards]

Thanks for setting this blog up - very cool! Have you had a chance to look at any of the Holman CSB leather bindings from B&H? I'd be curious to hear any thoughts as they are in scarce physical supply here in Minnesota...

[Dave]

ElShaddai,

Mark probably knows better than I, but I've handled the HCSB minister's Bible and the HCSB Apologatics study bible in genuine leather. Both have sewn bindings and seem pretty well made (although one of the minister's Bibles at the bookstore was standing up on the shelf and the top part of the text block was pulling away from the spine due to the weight, but the others seemed fine). The ministers Bible's paper is way too thin IMO, but the Apologetic's study Bible's paper is nice. Similar to the NIV Archaeological study Bible's paper. On both the Minister's and Apologetics Bible, the genuine leather is similar to a Zondervan NIV genuine leather Bible. I.e., nothing spectacular, but useable. Probably too cardboard-like to be featured on this blog! ;)

Hope that helps,

Dave

[Richard]

I really appreciate your blog--thank-you! It would be interesting to see a "top 10" list of the best and worst in binding/design.

Richard of the Great White North

[Don Harris]

Mark,

Thanks for initiating this conversation and inviting us to join you. At this time I don't have anything new to add to the conversation. However, I do want you to know that your passion and mission (if it can be called a mission) resonates with me. Perhaps our collective voice will influence and determine a few Bible publishing projects that are beneficial and beautiful.

Beneficial includes the topics you write about so knowledgeably, i.e. typesetting, typography, layout and design, readability, paper and binding, etc. Beauty, ah beauty! Let me mention a few: the aesthetic attraction of fine leather you smell and caress,something that ages along with you and becomes a part of you taking on your form and characteristics, your personality; the perfections of fine paper suitable for reading and writing, delicate and durable; gilded ages that reflect the treasured contents; ribbons to mark your last or next appointments with God; and, wide margins sufficient for annotations with elegant page proportions. After all, doesn't it seem right, isn't it congruent for the glory of the Word of God to be matched, to be beneficial and beautiful? Evidently some of us think so.

Just a personal note. I have been a Bible student, pastor and missionary for more than thirty years. Yet, it wasn't until I read you blog that I ordered my first premeir Bible, an ESV tan highland goatskin leather. from Allan's. It is a work of art.

Thanks for raising the standard for Bible publishing projects.

Don

[Charles Hadden]

Thanks for the invitation. I am loaded with questions which I will probably ask one at a time. What do people who care about high quality bindings and paper think of writing in your bibles? I found Jose post about pens helpful and went out and purchased some. Is this the place to post questions or should we email you?? What if a question doesn't relate to the post? I picked up 2 of the cheap but nice esv portfolio style. My wife is especially enjoying it. Thanks for the recommendation. Peace.

[Jesus Saenz]

I write in my ESV Single Column Reference as well as in my ESV Deluxe Heirloom Reference, both of which are bound in calfskin and I tend to care about high quality bindings and paper. Take a look at my recent blog about paper thickness and opacity... I found it interesting.

http://souldesaenz.blogspot.com/2007/11/bible-paper-too-thin-or-not-opaque.html

[matt]

I used to highlight and write in pencil or blue pen but have now stopped for various reasons. I am currently using archival quality pens for underlining and writing.

Regarding writing in your bibles, I prefer non-excessive marking since it can become difficult and distracting in the future when I reread the passage. If the bible in wide margin than I may include more detailed notes.

[Kyle]

Regarding writing in your Bible: Unless I anticipate giving it away, I always write in my Bibles. It just doesn't feel like my own until I scrawl something in it no matter the cost/quality of the Bible. I want it to be "my" tool..."my" sword that I can wield easily. I like a well used and marked Bible. It can be a record of your spiritual pilgrimage.

The biggest issue I have is that I own too many swords! I remember when I was a new believer and I owned just one Bible. I had almost every location in that thing memorized from constant use. I believe we subconsciously pick up on these things. I play guitar and it works the same way. Also, different guitars have different feels. Different Bibles are laid out different ways. I tend to have to "scramble" to find that passage in a Bible I'm not accustomed to. It's great to have a large arsenal of weapons but I guess I need to pick up one sword out of the pile and put my fingerprints all over it...to make it my main weapon. I can use the others but repetition with the one seems to form a bond. Have any of you other folks noticed this?

Thanks Mark for your great site. It seems that most of the threads do indeed start to take on a life of their own! :)

[Kyle]

Regarding writing in your Bible: Unless I anticipate giving it away, I always write in my Bibles. It just doesn't feel like my own until I scrawl something in it no matter the cost/quality of the Bible. I want it to be "my" tool..."my" sword that I can wield easily. I like a well used and marked Bible. It can be a record of your spiritual pilgrimage.

The biggest issue I have is that I own too many swords! I remember when I was a new believer and I owned just one Bible. I had almost every location in that thing memorized from constant use. I believe we subconsciously pick up on these things. I play guitar and it works the same way. Also, different guitars have different feels. Different Bibles are laid out different ways. I tend to have to "scramble" to find that passage in a Bible I'm not accustomed to. It's great to have a large arsenal of weapons but I guess I need to pick up one sword out of the pile and put my fingerprints all over it...to make it my main weapon. I can use the others but repetition with the one seems to form a bond. Have any of you other folks noticed this?

Thanks Mark for your great site. It seems that most of the threads do indeed start to take on a life of their own! :)

[Charles Hadden]

You are so right about that too many Bibles thing. Sometimes I have a hard time picking which one I want to take with me. It is also part of the problem with pulling the trigger for a high quality bible. I could buy one now but next week a better one comes out and don't forget the ESV study bible coming out in a yesr or so!! What is a bibliophile to do!?!

Another question: What do you folks think of bible covers leather or otherwise? Is there anyone out there who will not write in their bible?

[Denis]

The hardest for me in deciding to get a good Bible that would last is that I decided to switch to the ESV, but none of the high quality Bibles came with the updated text (or would, I estimated, in the year or so after I wanted to buy). In the end, I did purchase the Allan's ESV (3 or 4 months ago now).

On Bible covers, I am pretty sure one hastened the degradation of my bonded-leather Life Application Study Bible's cover & binding. I am using one now for my new Allan's, but only as a carrying case for when I leave the house with it; I don't actually fit the Bible's cover into the cover itself.

Also, I'm a guy that doesn't write in my Bible at all. Perhaps its my level of confidence or maturity, but its just not something that seems right for me to be doing yet.

[Kyle]

Concerning Bible covers: I don't use them. On my job I carry multiple Bibles (yes, at least three and a commentary or other book) in one of those over-the-shoulder type bags. I keep my Bibles in their respective boxes inside the bag with all my pens and such (yes, I am a total geek). When going to church or a Bible study, I simply carry the Bible naked. I like to feel the leather and don't want to be encumbered by a cover. I tend to think that the oil from your hands helps keep the leather soft and supple. This is just me.

Concerning Bible Marking: Here's some interesting links on D.L. Moody:
http://www.wholesomewords.org/etexts/moody/moodybmk.html
http://www.biblebelievers.com/moody/20.html

Kinda makes me want to have that one sword mentioned earlier. I sometimes think that our consumer mentality, which breeds discontent in many things, may also breed discontent in our Bibles. Not the actual word of God, of course, but the translation, the format, the construction, etc.. No translation is perfect and never will be but I do think it important to pick one to use regularly for memorizing, study, teaching, etc.. Wouldn't it be great to have one like Moody's that you invested much time and toil in, that had been with you for years, that had seen great use, that you could slide your hands over and find just what you are looking for without skipping a beat? Is this my quest or am I simply infected with discontent and the inability to commit to one Bible? Is finding a Bible like finding a mate? If we find a good one should we settle down and commit to it without having our eyes checking out the latest thing? Are we really actually searching for the perfect Bible? Is "she" out there? Maybe this is a confession of a guy that finds it hard to commit. Any others out there like me? Am I completely warped? Is there hope? :)

[Jesus Saenz]

I do not think that the cover actually led to the degradation to the Life Application Study Bible. It is a huge Bible at 2" thick with a glued binding and the quality of the bonded leather is poor. Consider not using the cover on your Allan's Bible as the oil form your hand will actually help preserve the leather.

The ESV's with the updated text and calfskin are the Single Column Reference and the Large Print

[Denis]

Good point about the construction quality of the Life Application Study Bible; 5 years of use could have simply been too much for it.

As for the cover for my Allan's, I only use for carrying the Bible to church & back in an attempt to protect it from the elements. I don't want to have to worry about it too much juggling it, the kids and whatever else we've hauled along for the trip.

Also, it'll be nice when the updated ESV text filters into all the premium editions, but realistically I bought this Bible with the expectation that it would have the durability to be my primary Bible for years to come. I am finding the HarperCollins's text is a nice bonus though; finally a text where words like honour, counsellor and practise are spelled correctly :)

[Eric Morgan]

I thought I was the only one who had this kind of fetish/sickness ;-)

I have recently went on a bible buying spree. Cambridge Goatskin KJV as well as Single column ESV (Goatskin) and Classic Thinline ESV (Goatskin). If someone was to publish a parallel KJV/ESV wide margin wrapped in Goatskin... that would be the bible for me!!!

I have considered buying a KJV and ESV Thinline and sending them off to be rebound together in one volume.

Anyone seen Tony Reinke's "Blank Bible" project? http://spurgeon.wordpress.com/2006/11/30/tss-blank-bible-index/

[matt]

Eric - where did you find the "Single column ESV (Goatskin) and Classic Thinline ESV (Goatskin)" editions in goatskin? I have only seen them in calfskin. Its exciting if they are somewhere in goatskin.

[matt]

HAPPY THANKSGIVING Bible Binding bloggers!!!

I have to wonder what a binding with turkey is like. Introducing the New ESV Turkey bound Thanksgiving edition...a bible to be thankful about all year long.

[PDS]

I was thinking the same thing!

[chuck bridgeland]

"You are not alone! There are people out there who share your obsessive interest in quality and aesthetics, and this is where they hang out."

I'm one that is tired of expensive but cheaply put together Bibles. Once upon a time (AKA, when I was a kid) even the cheapest gift bible had a sewn binding. Not so now.

Any thoughts on the Reformation Study Bible?

[J. Mark Bertrand]

Chuck, my thoughts on the Reformation Study Bible are found in the review I did of the Spirit of the Reformation Study Bible, which I find the better of the two:

http://jmarkbertrand.typepad.com/bibledesign/2007/09/spirit-of-the-r.html

I will say that my original NKJV New Geneva Study Bible (the precursor to the RSB) has held up pretty well over the years. I get the impression the new RSBs aren't made to quite as high a standard, but perhaps I'm wrong.

[Nathan]

I've been browsing here for almost a month now. I stumbled on this blog while looking for a higher quality bible for study and daily use. The article about wide margin bibles was the first one that I read and has prompted a purchase and also provoked me to try something new. After all of my years in university and the many bibles that I own, I've never written in a single text or bible. I've finally purchased my first quality bible and have started reading it, though I've not yet written in it as it's only a week old to me still. If you're wondering, I bought a brown-red In Touch NASB and also three Pigma Micron pens sized 01 (0.25mm) in brown, orange, and black ink. I'll quit typing here and post the other thoughts I've been saving in the relevant places, just wanted to introduce myself.

[Eric Morgan]

@ Matt : I completely misspoke... My two ESV's are Calfskin. My new Cambridge Wide Margin KJV is Goatskin. Thanks for the correction.

[Francis Cardullo]

Yesterday I was elated to have (finally) found this blog for the first time. Finally, a group of likeminded people! After taking the time to read through many of the comments posted here, I have a few questions relating to my own search for a bible. And dearly hope the fine folks over here have some of the answers!

I must first apologize in advance for the length of this comment in the web-ADD era’s self imposed rule of 2-3 paragraphs maximum. While I could hammer people with a long list of short succinct questions that would hopefully get me to the answer I think I am seeking, I think it would be far more beneficial to provide a complete description of what I am after in order that those more knowledgeable than myself actually have the information needed to render an accurate opinion.

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~~~~ Skip to the end for a summary of questions without the full picture ~~~~
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I should start with my general ending goal and minimum specifications for my new bible. I intend to use this bible almost every day for the next 30++ years in daily teachings, travel, and everyday study, so quality and craftsmanship are of the utmost importance to me, as is readability…. And then size and usefulness and everything else (so in other words, just like many of the other people here, I’m searching for the perfect bible!)

~~ Basic specs: ~~
KJV, wide margin, best goatskin cover available (emphasis on practicality and durability over looks), a good durable sewn binding, opaque paper that doesn’t show too much bleed, and a somewhat reasonable size (read that, lack of excessive extra materials bound into the back).

Also of note: I am relatively new to the field of fine crafted bibles and their history. If I make a comment that seems to fly in the face of what you know to be true… kindly correct me, I am going off what I know and have observed, some of which is almost guaranteed to be false.

~~~~Past experience with bibles~~~~
My past experience has been with Oxford KJV wide margin bibles. My mother has a 30+ year old oxford bound in Morocco Goatskin that has held up beautifully to daily abuse. A friend of mine has a 10yr old Oxford that when put up next to my mothers bible for comparison… well.. doesn’t compare at all. The binding on the newer oxford is far less precise and the pages are far less opaque, to the point of interfering with readability. I should note that the newer Oxford is, to my untrained eye, “genuine leather”. It says “Colina Grain Hide” on the box, but google’s never heard of it and the quality just isn’t up to specs for even calfskin. I have never owned a Cambridge, although the ones my friends have seem to have held up a bit less over the years than those who had oxfords.

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~~~~ Two courses of action available: ~~~~
1) Find one to buy
2) Have one custom bound

NOTE: I did find and contact Allans of Scotland last week. Unfortunately they do not produce a wide margin bible of any sorts and do not do custom work.

~~~~ First Option: Find one to buy ~~~~
Oxford wide margins, of which I have the most past experience with, seem to have all but faded from the scene, with very few available, and NONE that I can find in goatskin. The only one that I could find was a calfskin version over at cbd.com
Cambridge does offer a wide margin in goatskin (hooray!) however the HxWxD measurements online suggest that the bible is a bit too big to be of practical everyday use, and it’s also one of those editions that includes everything but the kitchen sink in the back of the bible (concordance, dictionary, note paper, blank paper, maps, etc).

~~~~ Second Option: Have one custom bound ~~~~
I can probably get a set of unbound Oxford Brevier Clarendon KJV Wide Margin sheets, which would then leave me with the task of locating a true master crafter to bind the goatskin cover to the pages. (anyone have any recommendations?).

Since I would already be having the bible custom bound, another thought occurred to me: Why not have the volumes of personal study notes and appendices that I already have condensed down, printed on bible paper, and bound into the back of the bible in place of the usual concordances and dictionaries that I have no use for anyway. I have more than enough content to print a 50-100 page appendix of my own and the typeface and layout would be a far more compressed format than I would be able to handwrite it in.

This idea REALLY excites me and is one of the reasons I’m leaning strongly towards the custom bound option… at least until someone brings me back down to earth. Of course this would also require that I find a printer capable of printing on a bible paper and willing to do a short run (single copy) print of it.

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~~~~Summary of questions (that I can think of):~~~~
(1) What is more “likely” to last longer under daily usage, a current edition Oxford / Cambridge or a custom bound one?
(2) Anyone know of a printer that can do the printing for a custom appendix?
(3) What the heck happened to Oxford? I can find very little from them these days in comparison to Cambridge
(4) I had always thought Oxfords to be of a higher quality than Cambridge, an (inexperienced) opinion that does not appear to be shared by the more experienced folks here… should I be abandoning my past view?
(5) Is there any other game in town besides Cambridge/Oxford to purchase a quality KJV wide margin from?
(6) Custom leather slipcover from the folks over at renaissance-art.com -- purely on the grounds of long term durability for the bible, good idea or bad one? (Does it add extra stress on the binding because it’s not as limp as the original bible’s goatskin cover?)
7) Paper quality – is this something that I really have any control over or is it pretty much take what you can get? Also, Oxford VS Cambridge, any thoughts in regards to paper?

~~~~Questions pertaining specifically to the binding of a custom bound bible: ~~~~
(1) Anyone know a good (magnificent) custom bindery? I saw Paul Sawyer mentioned in another post. Availability of materials to them would of course also be of note. I had hoped for the highland (no heat) goatskin, but that is a minor quibble not a major one)
(2) Full-yapp (if available) or semi-yapp? Advantages of one or the other in regards to durability?
(3) Edge gilding – is this purely an aesthetic issue or does it impart an increase in durability?
(4) Silk or Leather lining?
(5) I’m assuming full sewn is the best way to go…

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~~~~If you made it reading this far, THANKS!~~~~
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[Nathan]

Well for starters I can't really comment on any of the custom options at all really. I'm also curious why you want goatskin and are ruling out calfskin? I can't imagine that there is much difference in the long term, but I could be wrong I suppose. There seems to be very few options in bibles (for you) that are still available for purchase anymore, though I found quite a few results at affordable prices from amazon and christianbook, etc.

After some checking the bible that seems to match your requirements the best (due to it's thinner size than the other three) appears to be this one:

Cambridge Cameo in Calfskin
ISBN 9780521536967

Followed closely by:

Cambridge Concord in Goatskin
ISBN 9780521536981

Cambridge Concord in Calfskin
ISBN 9780521509183

Oxford Brevier in Calfskin
ISBN 9780191179518

In my opinion Cambridge has the finest bible paper I have ever laid hands on, though I've never seen a high quality Oxford in person. Hopefully someone else can pitch in with more information on other binding and custom options though. I'm sure there are other options I've overlooked but that is the best I can do with google in 30 minutes. Hope it helps somewhat.

[Jesus Saenz]

Francis,

wide margin and portability are mutually exclusive. There are very few publishers that are printing the KJV in a wide margin edition, even less are printing one that would be "portable". Sadly, Cambridge has stopped printing the Cameo edition which is more compact than the Concorde edition. The Concorde wide margin is 7.25" x 9" x 1.5" with a font size of 8 pt.

I am a proponent of owning a Bible quiver, owning more than one Bible to fill specific needs. If you are actually considering the expense of a custom re-bind maybe you should consider owning more than one Bible to that end. For studying purposes I use a wide margin Bible, for reading I use a personal size Bible and for teaching purposes I use a large print. For me, the size of the Concorde wide margin is not too large to tote. I have never really been turned off by the size of a Bible, but then again I am on the large side with big cartoon hands.