New Details on the Cambridge ESV Pitt Minion

David Dewey attended the Christian Resources Exhibition, the largest event of its kind in the UK, where he had the opportunity to chat with the Bible publishing staff of Cambridge University Press. Here's the latest information about the forthcoming ESV Pitt Minion:

Expected publication date: July or August, with the wide margin a few months later

Text: ESV (2007 revisions) with American spellings

Red letter? There will be a choice of red and black letter editions

Covers: Tu-tone, French Morocco and Calfskin

One will be a brown Calfskin, black letter edition.

Print: the same as other Pitt Minions in the series (NIV, KJV, NKJV). Very readable in my opinion.

Cross-references: the same as in the Crossway editions

Concordance: some as in Crossway editions, but a more extensive concordance is promised for the wide margin editions

Cost: £33 up. French Morocco c. £55; and calfskin somewhat more

I'm very pleased to hear about the brown calfskin black-letter edition! Thanks, David, for sharing this information with everyone.

Comments

[David Dewey]

What Mark was too modest to say was that Cambridge has been taking careful note of his comments and reviews as well as the traffic on this blog. At the Exhibition, I was able to handle some of the other Pitt Minion Bibles in the same series (NIV, NKJV, KJV). The ESV will have the same size and look. Cambridge are clearly back on form with regards to their leather bindings. And the font, at just under 7 pt, is very readable. Even with vari-focal specs, my eyes struggle somewhat with Crossway's original compact ESV (I haven't seen the deluxe edition); but the Pitt Minion was fine, even under the poor lighting of the Exhibition Centre. (The wide margin editions will be 8 pt.
What I especially like about the Pitt Minions is their overall size - less than 7" by 5" - larger than a compact but smaller than a regular Bible; only the Personal Size editions come close). And I am delighted there will be choice of black letter, a factor which will improve sales in the UK market and among purists like Mark in the USA.
For UK Bible readers, Collins' new editions (with 2007 text) are due out at the beginning of June. The range, with anglicised spellings, includes a tru-tone compact deluxe edition which I have pre-ordered.

[Ralph A. Abernethy III]

Great news! Do you have a link to the Collins ESV website?

[Jerry]

No goatskin. Now I know why Amazon tells me "this version is no longer available" in my wishlist.

[Matthew Johnson]

Sigh. Why can't I get a Pitt Minion NRSV :-/ The bindings for that translation compared to others are atrocious.

[David Dewey]

For the Collins website go to http://www.harpercollins.co.uk/Default.Aspx then put "esv" in the search box. The Collins ESVs can also be found on the UK Amazon site: www.amazon.co.uk - put "esv collins" in the search box.

[Paul T. McCain]

But still no Apocrypha, even from Cambridge?

[Kathy]

Will any of the ESV Pitt Minions have art-gilt page edges?

[Jerry]

Is there such a thing as an ESV Apocrypha?

[David N]

I'm sad there won't be a goatskin version, I was really looking forward to that.

Doesn't that translate into about $110 for the calfskin? Isn't that a bit pricey? I thought the Pitt Minion goatskins were that price.

Will they have the art gilt?

[David N]

Jerry (or anyone else),

How did you find the Cambridge ESV on Amazon? I haven't been able to find it, not even for pre-order. Actually, I couldn't find it on Cambridge's site either.

[Kathy]

David, for the ESV Pitt Minion search for this isbn: 0521708133. Here is the isbn for the wide margin ESV: 0521708168 (I don't know how to post links here)

I don't think it is listed on the Cambridge site yet, not sure how Amazon got it. They also have listings for the French Morocco editions, I didn't save those.

[Greg Terry]

Jerry, I'm with you. I would love to have a NRSV Pitt-Minion and companion wide-margin Bible from Cambridge, both of course in a goatskin binding.

[Brian Fox]

If it has art-gilt edges, I will consider the calfskin edition. With my chocolate goatskin PSR ESV, I feel I have a better edition because of the single column paragraph format. I would really like it in goatskin with art-gilt, but the Pitt Minion Bibles I have used hurt my eyes, and I have to admit that I haven't looked at one since I got my glasses, but that font just didn't do it for me. I much prefer the 8pt Petit Medieval Clarendon 1159 in my Cambridge Cameo Bible. I either love or hate fonts, and that will be the deciding factor for me. Nevertheless, I hope this edition is a success so quality editions of the ESV become an item in greater demand. I am especially grateful that Cambridge has deigned to make an edition without the almost obligatory red-letters. Perhaps this world is becoming a friendlier place for people like me.

[Ben Ting]

Hi, I am new to this site. Got myself into here when I was looking for more info on the Cambridge Wide-margin & Pitt Minion bibles I ordered online. This is an awesome place. And indeed it is costly to read this blog...I have since placed order for 2 Allan bibles! (Never heard of Allan bible until here.)

[David Dewey]

1. Apocrypha. This is not planned. Early rumours that Collins might produce one were almost certainly unfounded. And as the ESV is used mainly by conservative evangelicals, this makes an Apocrypha even less likely.
2. Calfskin v. goatskin. In my conversation with Cambridge, I am not certain if calfskin or goatskin was specified (the conversation was quite wide-ranging), so I may be wrong on that point. But certainly expect a high quality leather binding from them in addition to French Morocco and either bonded leather or tu-tone. Other Pitt Minions in the range have goatskin, so that is also probably the case with the ESV. Sorry to mislead.
3. Edges. For other Pitt Minions Cambridge specifies "gilt" edges with French Morocco; and "art gilt" with the goatskin bindings. Art gilt means gold over red' gilt lacks the red, just the gold-coloured foil.
4. Cost. The NIV, NASB, NKJV and KJV goatskin Pitt Minions are all priced at £65 in the UK catalogue and $130 on the US website. French Morocco at £50 - £55 ($100-110)

[David N]

Kathy, thanks!

David, I do hope that it will be in goatskin. Ever since I stumbled upon the world of high quality Bibles, my dream has been a black goatskin ESV with art gilt edges. My dream may be a few months away from coming true!

I think I was confused on the pricing because my local Christian bookstore sells a few Pitt Minions for $110, and Amazon usually has them for around $90. Hopefully it will be the same with the ESV.

[Kyle Hedrick]

Greg and Matthew,

I am in as well for the NRSV wide margin Cambridge goatskin. I am using the Allan NRSV currently, but would prefer a more supple binding. I e-mailed Allan's prior to purchasing this particular edition to see if they intended to print in the highland goat. They were somewhat noncommittal, but suggested that once the current run was sold out, they may reprint in a better binding. So to assist them in running out (and because this is the only high quality NRSV I am familiar with) I purchased one. Mark will be reviewing the Allan NRSV soon so I will not go into detail, but will say that it was a little disappointing.

[W Larry Enzor]

Thanks for the heads up re: the upcoming Cambridge ESV editions. One question: Does anyone know yet what the dimensions of the wide margin editions will be? Specifically, I'm interested in the margin width, both on the inside and outside margins. My one complaint with the NASB Cambridge edition is that the inside margin is not as wide as the outside margin.

[Matthew Johnson]

Thanks for that info, Kyle. I know the NIV and NASB are probably the most popular translations in the US, but I can think of four denominations for which the NRSV is the unofficial official translation. I might prefer another translation, but as a United Methodist pastor I use the NRSV because that is what the people have in front of them on Sundays and it's what all of our curriculum is written from. Since it's my de facto translation of choice, I'd really like to see some high quality bindings. I'm afraid that even though the UMC, Episcopal Church, PC(USA), and Disciples of Christ combined could make a fairly large Bible purchasing market, they aren't buying many. I KNOW most of my people aren't reading it :-)

Yet.

[Fr. Matthew]

My guess (unsubstantiated and unfounded) is that any chance of an ESV Apocrypha will be the result of Evangelical Anglicans in the UK pressing for this. If such an animal ever were to come about, I'd be interested in a copy!

I'm a little surprised to hear that they aren't going with the goatskin for these editions. They did so with the NKJV editions. I wonder why the change with the ESV.

[Steve Robenalt]

I just check the ISBN (0521708168) above for the wide-margin version being discussed at Amazon and their information states that it is goatskin. This is what their description reads, "ESV Wide Margin Reference Edition ES746:XRM Black Goatskin Leather (Leather Bound)" There is also a date of November 30, 2008 next to the publisher.

Now I'm curious about what the layout will look like. I'm not familiar with the Pitt Minion editions. Can this be viewed online in other translations somewhere?

[Nathan Stitt]

Steve,

Here's a large image of the NASB wide margin:
http://www.cambridgebibles.com/Media/PubComProductCatalog/9780521702652.jpg
I've handled this one in person and it is very impressive, much nicer than the only Cambridge Bible which I own.

[Lee Miller]

For those of you checking on Amazon . . . a word of warning that Amazon isn't consistent or conscientious with its descriptions of bindings, colors, etc. If you're working from a particular ISBN and are confident it is the edition you want, you're probably safe, but if you're working from Amazon's descriptions you may end up returning a book to them. They tend to use "hard cover" and "soft cover" generically, and "leather" can mean just about anything.

[David Dewey]

This link shows what the NASB wide margins are like. The ESV will be identical in layout and typeface:
http://www.cambridge.org/uk/bibles/nasb/widemargin.htm
Page size will be 9 x 7.25 inches and the typeface 8pt (standard Pitt Minions are 7pt)
Scaling up the photo in the catalogue, I'm guessing around 2.4 inches outer margin; 1.75 bottom; 1 inch top and only .75 inner margin. Hope this helps.

[Rod Summers]

For those of you seeking an NRSV Wide Margin, Cambridge published one in the early 90s. It was published in both a bonded leather and hardback which I was able to hold and flip through. It was double column with no cross references (which is why I didn't purchase one). You can search on Amazon and buy a used hardback. I thought the text and layout were very good. Don't believe the apocrypha is available. Getting it recovered and sewn is an option for those who desire a WM version.

[Andrew]

Actually, there apparently will be an ESV Apocrypha, according to the Crossway FAQ (http://www.esv.org/about/faq): "Crossway will not be publishing the ESV in editions with the Apocrypha. An edition of the ESV with Apocrypha is being developed by another publisher, which we expect will be announced in mid to late 2008."

[Tim]

Hello and greetings in our Lord Jesus,

Greg Terry, May 15 2008 at 05:26PM' mentions a "chocolate goatskin PSR ESV" with "single column paragraph format", can someone please tell me more about this edition?

[Matthew Johnson]

Has anyone purchased a French Moroccan leather Bible from Cambridge recently? It's the only leather option for the NRSV and just got it today. Awful. I don't know how thin the leather is, but I'm pretty sure there's a healthy piece of cardboard under it. Or plywood. I like everything else about it, but there's no way it could do Bible yoga.

Also, thanks to Rod I got an NRSV Wide Margin on eBay for $13.00.

[David Dewey]

Yes, Matthew I have. I own two Brevier Reference RSVs, both in French Morocco leather. The older one, the burgundy which is no longer available (and which came in the open slip case which has a lovely coloured line drawing of King's College, Cambridge, across it) is delightfully soft and flexible and opens flat. The newer one, black (and in the current style boxed case with a large cross on the front) barely flexes at all, doesn't open flat, and in fact closes unless open more or less in the centre.
My source at Cambridge tells me it is all down to the glues and temperature. Cambridge used to do all their own bindings in-house in Cambridge (I visited the print shop around 15 years ago and saw this first hand), but the binding skills have simply disappeared. I gather all Cambridge fine bindings are not out-sourced to Europe, Holland I think. Since then, they claim that their bindings have returned to their former world-leading quality. Having recently handled several in the new Pitt Minion range (NASB, NIV and NKJV), I would agree. The ESV Pitt Minions should match up too: one I gather will be French Morocco.
Unlike Goatskin which softens with time, French Morocco leather is taken taken from a split calfskin, is slightly thinner than other grades and should be flexible and soft even when new. I fear your NRSV may not improve with age. This edition has been in the Cambridge range a few years now so, like my RSV, it may date from the time when Cambridge's usually very high standards were slipping.

[Jeremiah J.]

Oxford is putting out an ESV with apocrypha: www_amazon_com/English-Standard-Version-Bible-Apocrypha
Don;t know anything else about it though

[David Dewey]

The blurb on Amazon (US)is given below. Search under ISBN number 0195289102. Publication (by Oxford University Press which have commissioned the translating of the apocrypha apparently) is given as January. It is certainly not too difficult to produce: just take the RSV apocrypha, update along ESV translation principles and double-check with the Greek. But I am surprised Crossway is giving permission for their translation of the OT/NT ESV to be used in this way.

The English Standard Version Bible captures as far as possible the precise wording of the original biblical text and the personal style of each Bible writer, while taking into account differences of grammar, syntax, and idiom between current literary English and the original languages. The ESV thus provides an accurate rendering of the original texts that is in readable, high quality English prose and poetry. This Bible has been growing in popularity among students in biblical studies, mainline Christian scholars and clergy, and Evangelical Christians of all denominations.
Along with that growth comes the need for the books of the Apocrypha to be included in ESV Bibles, both for denominations that use those books in liturgical readings and for students who need them for historical purposes. More Evangelicals are also beginning to be interested in the Apocrypha, even though they don't consider it God's Word. The English Standard Version Bible with the Apocrypha, for which the Apocrypha has been commissioned by Oxford University Press, employs the same methods and guidelines used by the original translators of the ESV, to produce for the first time an ESV Apocrypha. This will be the only ESV with Apocrypha available anywhere, and it includes all of the books and parts of books in the Protestant Apocrypha, the Catholic Old Testament, and the Old Testament as used in Orthodox Christian churches. It will have a lovely pre-printed case binding, and will include a full-color map section, a table of weights and measures used in the Bible, and many other attractive features.
The English Standard Version Bible with Apocrypha is certain to become the preferred Bible in more conservative divinity schools and seminaries, where the Apocrypha is studied from an academic perspective. And it answers the need of conservative Christians in general for a more literal
version of these books.

[Andrew]

David: that's splendid! I'm ordering it ASAP.

[David N]

The last post said that the ESV would be available in the UK in July, but I still don't see any advertisement for it on Cambridge's website.

Does anyone know where to find a picture of it?

[David Dewey]

My understanding is that the ESV may be available late July/early August in the UK. The date for the USA is a couple of months later (the finished Bibles have to be shipped from Europe). Apparently, the sheets (pages) have been printed and seen by Cambridge. These sheets have to be made up into the signatures and these signatures have to be sown and bound.
The photos in the Cambridge catalogue is of other Pitt Minion Bibles (KJV, NKJV and NASB). You can find these at their website: http://www.cambridge.org/uk/bibles/ together with type samples. The ESV will be the same.

[David N]

David, thank you for the reply.

I just found it a bit odd that Cambridge wouldn't advertise the ESV on their UK website when it is coming out so soon.

[Bob Burns]

The first ESV with Apocrypha comes out January 1 from Oxford. If its not a glued binding, I might get it rebound. http://www.amazon.com/dp/0195289102

"The English Standard Version Bible captures as far as possible the precise wording of the original biblical text and the personal style of each Bible writer, while taking into account differences of grammar, syntax, and idiom between current literary English and the original languages. The ESV thus provides an accurate rendering of the original texts that is in readable, high quality English prose and poetry. This Bible has been growing in popularity among students in biblical studies, mainline Christian scholars and clergy, and Evangelical Christians of all denominations.

"Along with that growth comes the need for the books of the Apocrypha to be included in ESV Bibles, both for denominations that use those books in liturgical readings and for students who need them for historical purposes. More Evangelicals are also beginning to be interested in the Apocrypha, even though they don't consider it God's Word. The English Standard Version Bible with the Apocrypha, for which the Apocrypha has been commissioned by Oxford University Press, employs the same methods and guidelines used by the original translators of the ESV, to produce for the first time an ESV Apocrypha. This will be the only ESV with Apocrypha available anywhere, and it includes all of the books and parts of books in the Protestant Apocrypha, the Catholic Old Testament, and the Old Testament as used in Orthodox Christian churches. It will have a lovely pre-printed case binding, and will include a full-color map section, a table of weights and measures used in the Bible, and many other attractive features.

"The English Standard Version Bible with Apocrypha is certain to become the preferred Bible in more conservative divinity schools and seminaries, where the Apocrypha is studied from an academic perspective. And it answers the need of conservative Christians in general for a more literal version of these books."

[Robert]

Ok, is this the one we've been waiting for? (We = me, and maybe our gracious host)

Cambridge, ESV Wide-Margin Reference Black Goatskin ES746XM, due out in Feb of 09? Check the Cambridge webpage.

[Rod Summers]

Earlier in this series of posts some desired a to see a Cambridge wide margin NRSV in goatskin. While in London last week sifitng through one of the bookstores I happened to come across a new Cambridge WM NRSV in hardback. I bought it since it is out of print but am willing to let go of it if one would like to get it rebound in goatskin. The binding is sewn. It is double column, black letter, and does not have cross-references. It was produced in the 90's by Cambridge. You may contact me at rodsummers@comcast.net. Cheers!