Sneak Peek at the R. L. Allan's Personal Size Reference ESV

Just so you know, I have the new R. L. Allan Personal Size Reference ESVs in hand, and I'll be working on photos and a write-up over the next few days. Expect something early next week, which will give me a chance to live with them long enough to speak intelligently on the subject. (Let's hope.) In the meantime, I snapped a photo to prove they're here and pique your interest.

As you can see, these are the advance copies with the thin ribbons. The production Bibles will have ribbons twice this width. The red is tricky to photograph thanks to the way it changes in the light, but I'd say this shot is fairly representative.

Comments

[Matthew]

Ooooo...purrrrdy. :D

[Mathew Maughan Jr.]

Awesome. So what's the difference between these and the ESV1? I saw that they were single-column. They also look shorter and stouter. Looking forward to the review.

Also, I ended up getting an ESV1 on your recommendation a couple months ago. Definitely don't miss the money for this quality. Thanks for the reviews.

[Anthony S Colletti]

where is mine! I ordered the chocolate one from evangelicalbible (of course) would love a photo to see how size compares to the Pit Minion

[J. Mark Bertrand]

Don't worry, I'll be posting several comparison shots with the Pitt Minion, as well as my thoughts on how the two compare. These are advance copies -- the production units haven't shipped yet, to my knowledge. Mathew, if you check out the review of the Personal Size Reference from when it first came out (see the links in the righthand column) a lot of questions about what it is and how it compares to other editions will be answered. For the rest, you'll have to wait until next week!

[Bill]

Love the 1-column paragraph layout with the refs in the center gutter! Now if only...20% bigger font, 20% fewer words per line, 20% fewer lines per page, 40% thicker volume...then it would be perfect!

I'd be almost as happy if they kept the identical page layout and just scaled the spatial dimensions 20% to 6"x9", a standard book.

Who am I kidding? 20 years ago I'd have felt this very layout (and beautiful Allan binding) was just right. But it was all downhill after the age of 40. Seriously, crossways and Allan deserves a round of applause for bringing this truly unique Bible to fruition.

One question, I think it's been asked before...does this have maps in the back? It does have a 6k-word concordance, right? I'll await the full review.

[Brian McClurg]

You know the ESV is the perfect translation from the WORST MANUSCRIPTS!!!! If it isn't KJB it it is not for me! I prefer the WORDS OF GOD IN ENGLISH www.avpublications.com

[Cole Simmons.]

go away brian mcclurg.

[Robert]

Dear Brian,

Why visit a site that you have no interest in except to let everyone know how right you are and how wrong everyone else is? If "avpublications" is what excites you, then by all means HANG OUT THERE!

Thanks Mark for the update on the ESV Personal Size Reference.

[Knight]

Brian McClurg
Two points for you to consider:
1) The ESV is not a perfect translation. There are areas where it could be better. There is no perfect translation.

2) This blog is not about text and translation issues. (If I may be bold enough to speak for Mark) There are plenty of others that do deal with these issues I suggest you post your thoughts there instead of antagonizing people over here. If you truly want to convert people to your point of view then you should not start out by annoying them.

[Matt Morales]

A site by gail riplinger...seriously?!?...well lets put it this way, there are more scholarly and gracious conversations out there on the subject.

If you are KJV only remember that we are all the body of Christ and so try to be a helping hand instead of a rash.

[Jeff Seymour]

If Brian were to poll any of the readers of this blog I would be willing to bet that a majority percentage of them own and use King James bibles. As far as the WORDS OF GOD IN ENGLISH!, how about Hebrew or Greek! If Brian were the purist he pretends to be, he would learn the original languages that the inspired writers of God's Word wrote in originally. Personally, I love the Word of God in just about any English translation. The question one might ask is, "Has any English translation, however controversial, ever led a person away from God?"

[Brian McClurg]

goodness Brethren Calm Down, if your right than why go ballistic? or Do you have something to worry about? God Bless, Brian R McClurg

[California Dave]

Hi Brian. KJV is a wonderful translation and there are several top quality Bibles currently at market that Mark has extensively reviewed on this blog. I encourage you to check them out for yourself. The KJV still seems to hold the heavyweight title when it comes to top quality Bible construction/binding with high-end publishers/binders. Take R.L. Allan for example. Their flagship Bible is the Oxford Longprimer Reference edition, and their unique full yapp binding in the best quality highland goatskin is only available for print blocks using KJV (at least to my knowledge). Mark has reviewed this Bible and its certainly worth the time to read over. Moreover, with the 400 year anniversary of the AV coming up in 2011, I'm sure we'll be seeing some awesome printing and binding combinations within the next 18 months that Mark will be reviewing here on this blog for our benefit as well. Mark also seems to have this uncanny ability to uncover things in the works with publishers that us ordinary folk outside the printing field wouldn't discover until press time. For example, take a look at the KJV single column typology update Nelson is working on which Mark recently covered. This is cutting edge information (for the Bible publishing industry). Granted this format isn't for everyone. I personally welcome an update to the typography and believe it will make reading KJV an even more enjoyable experience...as far as my own personal preferences are concerned. Other blog readers here have different preferences than mine. I think its a good thing to have many options rather than a few. Another example, recently Mark posted an update indicating R.L. Allan has been officially granted the Royal Licence by Queen Elizabeth to publish the AV Bible in Scotland where the Sovereign holds the perpetual copyright. This is exciting news, and I first became aware of license granting by reading about it here on Mark's blog.

Mark's conviction and persistent effort in his blog have been incredibly helpful towards informing me what options in Bible print blocks and bindings are available. It was by reading this blog that I learned of R.L. Allan, or of the world of Bible rebinding and rebinding shops. I'm sure you have an AV Bible that has been well read with all kinds of personal notes and markings that you've made in it over the years. Perhaps the binding and/or print block has become so worn that the structural integrity of your cherished AV will be at risk with continued use. You can review Mark's archives on this blog respective to rebinding options and give your Bible a makeover, customized however you want it done, so you and your future generations can continue to use it.

[Lee Miller]

Regarding KJV . . . (I know it isn't the topic here, but what do we do when an unrelated topic comes up? This is a pretty interesting group to discuss things with) . . .

I am very divided on the whole textual issue. In fact, the issue of the canon is extremely complex and hard to penetrate. Why do we in fact have "the Bible" in the exact form we accept it today? The route is very circuitous and goes through various groups that modern Christians would have a hard time identifying with.

I am sympathetic with the "KJV only" perspective that God promised to preserve his word. Fundamentally, that's the only theory of the canon that works: God was somehow overseeing the whole process so that we ended up with the Holy Bible in its current form. And if you accept that, then you have to explain how God allowed the church to have a "corrupted" text (or defective, or deficient, whatever description you want to use) until 19th-century German and British scholars rediscovered the "right" text. I am still a little amazed when codexes Sinaiticus and Vaticanus are cited as the "best and oldest"--I mean, really, we're talking about two manuscripts . . . how do we really know they're all that good?

On the other hand, the KJV is not understandable to the average--or even the well-educated--Christian today. The language is too archaic, and after many years of making a valiant attempt to use it, I've given up. If I had to choose between the KJV and another translation (say ESV or NIV), I'd go with the other one simply on the basis of relative understandability. The difficulties of the KJV are understated by its proponents.

In my ideal world, there would be a modern translation from the Traditional Text (the NKVJ isn't that--they used an eclectic text, despite the name). But that's not going to happen, so for now I'm in the NIV/ESV camp. Uneasily, but there.

Lee

[Brian McClurg]

Ok Brethren Let me give you a brief testimony. I got saved in 1999 and at that time I had a 2nd to 3rd grade reading level. The first Bible that was given to me was the KJB and that for one might be why I love the book so much. On the other hand I learned to read from it too. Since then I have read through the Bible 27 times since 2001 (2001 was when I began to read through my Bible on a regular basis) I have used R.L. Allens, Oxford Long Primer, Cambridge, World, Nelson signature series reference bible, and Local Church Publishers. I have A video on youtube showing the Poor quality of R.L. Allen (not the leather Highland Goatskin) but rather the stitching and the other failures with Cambridge, oxford, Nelson and others. I have found, out of any Publisher or bindery, Church Publishers does the very best and they have never fell apart yet. So for more info check out my video on youtube called "the best Bible publishers". Thanks and God Bless

[H. Jim Keener]

Don't feed the trolls!
And yet, there are two things I cannot refrain from saying:
1) Lee, as for the claim that "the NKVJ isn't that--they used an eclectic text, despite the name," this is just plain wrong. The NT of the NKJV is the TR, just like the KJV. Perhaps you are referring to the fact that the NKJV's footnotes acknowledged differences between the TR and the most commonly used critical texts (denoted by a NU) and the Byzantine, or "Majority Text" (denoted by an MT). Citing differences in the footnotes is *not* the same thing as using an eclectic text in the translation.
2) Mark, you deserve high praise for staying focused on the purpose of your blog--design and binding, and steering clear of the many "which translation is better" debates raging. I am especially impressed with your willingness to evaluate such a diverse array of translations and keep your comments focused on the binding and design, without getting sidetracked in translation controversy. I'm also impressed with your willingness to show respect to so many posters who have such widely divergent views on which translation is best-ranging from KJV only people to those whe prefer the Message to mainline folk who prefer the NRSV with apocrypha.
Hat's off to you sir!

[Chuck Martin]

Although I wish Brian had been more tactful in his posts, I have to say I did find an interesting little video on binding at the Local Church Bible Publisher's web site and Brian's video held my attention.

I am slightly worried that Mark may be tempted to shill for some of the publishers, particularly R.L. Allen. I've noticed a large number of reviews for R.L. Allen and Cambridge products, and it appears that Mark is receiving not just one advance copy but entire sets from R.L. Allen. Yes, I do see that Mark has reviewed some products from other publishers. No, I don't believe it is inappropriate for a reviewer to receive one advance copy of a product. Yes, I understand that R.L. Allen and Cambridge are two of the highest quality houses. And no, I'm not sending Mark any supporting funds while I access his site for free. I'd just like to see a little more diversity if it is feasable.

I'm only concerned because I truly enjoy reading Mark's reviews and I believe this is a great site with information very hard to find elsewhere. Thank you Mark.

[Kyle Hedrick]

Wow. I popped back in just to see if anyone has received his or her copy of the new PSR binding -- and I thought I entered the wrong blog. Similar to Jim, I cannot resist making two observations:

1. If you read the KJB 27 times, and then denigrate others for a different translation choice, perhaps you are not understanding the KJB translation after all.

2. Mark, while you have spent time reviewing bindings such the NRSV XL (by Harper), ESV TrueGlo, Daily Reading Bible (ESV), the ESV on iPhone, Navipress' binding of The Message, numerous rebinding projects, etc. etc., and while you have taken the time to put together our Bible Readers Manifesto and the like, I would still appreciate it if you would PLEASE continue to place the primary focus of DESIGN and BINDING on those publishers who provide the best quality bindings and who (and this is the most important thing) LISTEN TO THIS BLOG AND TRY TO PROVIDE US WITH OUR EVER CHANGING DESIRES IN BINDINGS. R.L. Allan frequently reviews this blog and takes it to heart. How else do you explain them publishing an ESV PSR . . . . in RED? I believe Crossway is also a frequent reader, as is Cambridge. Thanks to those publishers who read this blog. Mark, the only problem I have with your handling of this blog is that you have chosen to prioritize your real job over multiple daily blog entries.

Thanks for all your hard work.

[Bill]

Kyle seems to want more of an emphasis on binding and less on design. But if we don't analyze different new designs, and praise those that excel for their readability or efficiency, how can we expect the bindery houses we like the most to know what to print, particularly if we think they're "listening" to us? So I say more power to Mark with his open-minded and eclectic approach to reviewing and discussing different designs. (The IBS's Books of the Bible is probably a great example of this. I think there are many on this blog who'd love to see a nice binding on this!)

In fact, I'd like to see us go even further afield and consider creative, new approaches to, say:
1. Illustrated bibles (ie those w/ artwork!) e.g. Thunder Bay Press release of the Urbino version (w/ 66-book Protestant canon)
2. The Lectionary, e.g. the new Mosaic bible

Either way we go, a world of thanks to Mark for the great site he's put together and manages. I trust him thoroughly to guide us well into the future.

Oh, and ain't that King James just the greatest? ;-)

[Brian McClurg]

Hey check out my video on the best Bible on the market and get this its only 55.00 dollars and it would retail for 2/3 more of that amount! Check it out and God Bless
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnZnL7feRp4

[Bill]

Say Brian, you seem to know Church Publishing pretty well...do they sell any of the single-column KJVs in a normal-margin version? (There are a lot of wide-margin lovers on this site but I'm not one of them.)

Also, do they use "pronouncing" texts? Ie, are there pronunciation marks on/over the trickier words? (I personally don't like those.) The images from that site are pretty blurry and slow-loading so I'm having trouble seeing details.

Thanks in advance.

[DavidT]

Brian, thanks for the excellent videos. Well done. I am a big fan of Allan's bibles, and I love my Cambridge NIV single column. But I am going to check out Church Publishers. Like Bill I would be interested in a KJV single column in normal-margin version. If they have that in the type of binding you showed in your video, I will be making a purchase. Also, thanks for getting the discussion back to binding and design. That's what we come here for.

[Brian McClurg]

Well praise the Lord! I do apologize to all my brethren for comments above. I am just a KJV fanatic and sometimes I can't help myself, but A brother here on the blog said "we are all brothers in Christ". Well needless to say, that was a convicting statement and I do love my Brethren no matter what version they use. God Bless, Brian R McClurg

[Matt Morales]

Brian - Very interesting video. It sounds like you read your bible alot...thats great. I have not had the same problem with my Allans bibles but maybe I do not read them enough :)

On the bibles that have had the problems you described on the video, have you noticed any particular way of handling them that decreases longevity? Or do you just use them so much that they burn out fast.

Bible publishers sounds interesting...have to check em out.

[Matt Morales]

REGARDING THE RED PSR:

After looking at the pics I have to admit what I love about the red psr is the same thing I love about business suits...is that navy with red is a great combo. I used to have a sales job that required me to wear a suit everyday and after a while I got bored of the "standard" color combos and did further research on what "works". Its all a matter of preference, but a navy suit with a red tie is just great (a red suit with a navy tie would work great but they are rarer than red bibles).

What I find rare about what Allan has done is that it is hard to find a well bound RED bible anywhere, let alone with blue ribbons. most red bibles would come with black, gold, or red ribbons. But NAVY ribbons on a red bible is a stylish and classy step forward in my opinion.

[Brian McClurg]

I would Like to make a comment about a statement I had made. I said I have read through the Bible 27 times. Please I was not trying to boast, If you knew my background you would now why I have had the opportunity to do so. In 1999 I was diagnosed with GAD (Generalized Anxiety Disorder), My life till late 2006 six was a life of extreme fear and anxiety from the old life of Drinking and smoking that caused a serotonin deficiency which I believe was something I was reaping for things sown. Dear brothers in Christ please understand the only reason I have read the Bible that many times was because the only Book that would throw fear and anxiety out the window was the word of God and prayer. I literally was disabled for those years and could not work. So All I did was Read and Read the Bible. Would you please be in prayer for me because I still deal with it hear and there. I've had attacks behind the pulpit and that my friend is scary But I believe God used this instrument as he did Paul to keep me humble and to keep My focus on the Book (the Bible). God Bless you and yours, Brian R McClurg

[Brian McClurg]

I was going through My stack this morning and wanted to make a another suggestion. I have a Signature series KJV reference Bible from back in the day when Abba used to bind the Bibles for nelson. They are hard to find since they stopped making them (the KJV reference edition with full yapp Calfskin). If you can find them anywhere online its a good investment because the new line of signature series Bibles don't use Abba anymore but rather they use a bindery that uses a real then cut of calfskin. It's sad that they would go that route but I believe that the most durable of the Series was the reference edition.

[mike smith]

Brian thankyou for your sharing, I will be praying for you and your ministry, I enjoyed your youtube input also. I agree about reading the Bible for spiritual help. I need to read more and more not only when I am under stress but more everyday.

[California Dave]

Brian, I'd never heard of Local Church Bible Publishers prior to your post(s) and I want to personally thank you for this valuable contribution towards the objective of Mark's blog here on Bible Design and Binding. The video clip provided on the site was informative and I've learned more about the assembly process because of it. I've posted the link below for the convenience of any other interested readers:

http://www.lcbplansing.org/Files/LCBP_Bindary_Movie_NEW.wmv

The foiling process for pages was interesting. It didn't appear art guilding was used (the red dye), but the gold foiling sure would seem to beat spray on gold hands down. It also appeared glue strip reinforcements were used on the print block binding for extra durability. This seems like it would make the Bible less flexible than those using just the sewn block binding such that perhaps the finished Bible wouldn't lay as flat. Of course, I'm just speculating, and it certainly appears from the representations made in your youtube posting that this Bible has been far more durable than any other you've used to date. The price is what blows me away. $55 for a calfskin leather binding with sewn reinforcement around the covers. This certainly seems like a value of which I've not come across in a long time. It wasn't clear to me what other "helps" were included (ie types and number of maps, number of cross references, etc.).

I hope Mark is able to secure a copy of the premium calfskin version of this Bible and run it through the same yoga gymnastics and other critical criteria he uses for his other Bible reviews respective to page formatting, binding quality, assembly quality, etc. A direct comparative review with other KJV offerings previously reviewed would be insightful and a very enjoyable read.

Mark's blog continues to mine jewels like this CBP calfskin Bible from other God and Bible loving folks out there in cyberland and its what keeps me coming back for more.

[Brian McClurg]

I did a new Bible video review for you brothers, on local Church Bible Publishers. YES it has the yoga and a new RED Bible on there so go check it out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFECObfbN2Y

[Brian McClurg]

I have two videos where I Have Changed the Ribbons in the Text block not behind it so check em out www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkJv5MEwEVs and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFECObfbN2Y

[Kathy]

Nice videos, Brian. If it is not too much trouble I would be interested to know how to change the ribbons in a Bible so they look professionally done. Thanks!

[Bill]

Me too.

[Jeff Seymour]

Hey Brian...I have put ribbons in just about all of my bibles. Most ribbons are just glued into the bible with a water soluble glue called pva. This stuff is the same as Elmer's glue. By moistening the headband with a cue tip dipped in water (not soaked), you can usually take it out along with the ribbon(s). Place the glue on both sides of new ribbons about 1 inch. Add glue to the side of the headband that faces the text block. Carefully place new ribbons and the headband back in the bible and put some wax paper between the headband and the spine of the bible (wiping away any excess) and allow to dry for several hours. Don't do this unless you have every confidence that you can accomplish it without ruining your bible. I have done this with Allan, Cambridge, Thompson, Ryrie and various vintage bibles that I have purchased on Ebay. I have also put ribbons in regular books using this same method. Also, while I don't share your views on bible translations (I use KJV along with many others), I do praise the Lord for your zeal and commitment to His Word. I apologize for any negative posts I have made regarding your comments.

[Knight]

For those who want to see the other side of the KJV-only debate take a look at the following:

http://vintage.aomin.org/kjvo.html

I will not debate this here as this blog is not the place for such things but much has been said recently and KJV-only websites have been promoted so I have felt compelled to provide information of the other side of the argument. If you are interested in this issue take a look and judge for yourself.

[Gary Brown]

Back to the PSR

Looks like there's a delay in these bibles being shipped. Now the R L Allan's site gives a date of late October...

[threegirldad]

EvangelicalBible is now saying that they expect to receive their shipment of PSRs on Oct. 26.

[Jason Turning]

I started reading the KJV and finished the New Testament before being baptized and proceeding on to the Old Testament. Before finishing I switched to an NIV. Later I switched to an NASB, NLT and now ESV. Also owning a parallel Bible, and they all work for me except for not being too fond of The Message. And as followers of Jesus Christ we have much bigger issues while in this world to focus on than arguing about translation versions. Plus, if you want to be hard core about reading the Bible, you should be reading the original language and not a translation. So I suggest you read what works for you and trust God for the rest.

I watched Brian's videos, but there wasn't a R.L. Allen showed, just mentioned. I own an Allan ESV1, and it's very nice, and holding up fine for me. I'm very happy with the Bible.

I bought a synthetic Cambridge Pitt Minion that I enjoy using as a travel Bible, but do have some concerns with the build quality. I do like the paper and print on the Pitt Minion ESV though. I don't think I care so much for the synthetic material and wouldn't buy synthetic again. So I'm quite looking forward to Mark's detailed reviews of the Personal Size Allan Bibles to see if a purchase is in my future.

[Brian McClurg]

THE CREED OF
THE ALEXANDRIAN CULT
1. There is no final authority but God.
2. Since God is a Spirit, there is no final authority that can be seen,
heard, read, felt, or handled.
3. Since all books are material, there is no book on this earth that
is the final and absolute authority on what is right and what is wrong,
what constitutes truth and what constitutes error.
4. There WAS a series of writings one time which, IF they had all been
put into a BOOK as soon as they were written the first time, WOULD
HAVE constituted an infallible and final authority by which to judge truth
and error.
5. However, this series of writings was lost, and the God who inspired
them was unable to preserve their content through Bible-believing
Christians at Antioch (Syria), where the first Bible teachers were (Acts
13:1), and where the first missionary trip originated (Acts 13:1-52), and
where the word “Christian” originated (Acts 11:26).
6. So God chose to ALMOST preserve them through Gnostics and
philosophers from Alexandria, Egypt, even though God called His Son
OUT of Egypt (Matthew 2), Jacob OUT of Egypt (Genesis 49), Israel
OUT of Egypt (Exodus 15), and Joseph’s bones OUT of Egypt (Exodus
13).
7. So there are two streams of Bibles. The most accurate—though,
of course, there is no final, absolute authority for determining truth and
error; it is a matter of “preference”—are the Egyptian translations from
Alexandria, Egypt, which are “almost the originals,” although not quite.
8. The most inaccurate translations were those that brought about
the German Reformation (Luther, Zwingli, Boehler, Zinzendorf, Spener,
et al.) and the worldwide missionary movement of the English-speaking
people: the Bible that Sunday, Torrey, Moody, Finney, Spurgeon,
Whitefield, Wesley, and Chapman used.
9. But we can “tolerate” these if those who believe in them will
“tolerate” US. After all, since there is NO ABSOLUTE AND FINAL
AUTHORITY that anyone can read, teach, preach, or handle, the whole
thing is a matter of “PREFERENCE.” You may prefer what you prefer,
and we will prefer what we prefer. Let us live in peace, and if we cannot
agree on anything or everything, let us all agree on one thing: THERE
IS NO FINAL, ABSOLUTE, WRITTEN AUTHORITY OF GOD ANYWHERE
ON THIS EARTH.
This is the Creed of the Alexandrian Cult.

[Fred C]

Brian McClurg, I gather from your "CULT CREED" post above (and other comments) that you are acting as both judge and accuser of those you call your brothers and sisters. What is good for you is law for all? If one doesn't employ the KJV alone, then fail God's test? Beyond this, you have perverted the purpose of Mark's website to your own desires. Is this fruit good? The Lord rebuke you.

[Knight]

Brian,

I have no desire to debate you on this blog. Such would be disrespectful to those who read and enjoy it.

Both positions have been represented via links. I suggest we allow people to read the available information and decide for themselves.

[Brian McClurg]

Why Would Jesus Christ, "the Word" Rebuke me for BELIEVING the Bible? Weird Business with the Alexandrians. You know their is alot of good people and saved too that end up in cults. Well such as Knight and others, and I'm sure they are sincere and love the Lord. The Problem the Alexandrian Cult is simple "you need a guru to interpret scripture" where as In true Christianity all you need is the Bible and the Holy Spirit. Somebody said If I was to read the Bible through, then read it in the originals. Well My friend there are NO originals anymore and even If I had the Originals they would only verify the Pureness of the King James Text. I took three years of Greek and Hebrew and it didn't budge me a bit! I personally believe that when a Person gets saved they believe the KJB IS THE WORD OF GOD. They have to get educated out of that belief from People Like James White AKA "Snow White" the self proclaimed apologist and scholar, when really he is professional LIAR. His work "the king james only controversy" has been refuted by many a true student of scripture, with the outcome of one Lie every 6-7 pages. James White is a "scholar in residence" LOL what a Joke! Maybe the problem today is false conversion, especially in the reformed theology group. The DEFORMED theologians are to busy readng other Books rather than THE BOOK! so the outcome could be exactly what the Lord said (John 8:47) He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

[Knight]

For the benefit of those reading the presuppositions in Brian's last statement are as follows:
1. KJV only = Word of God
2. Those who disagree with #1: Cultists and liars.
3. Original Texts (if they still existed) would agree with the KJV exactly.
4. If someone does not believe #1 they are not Christian. (Brian - you may not have exactly meant this but I have a hard time reading your statement any other way.)

Here are some facts:
1. The KJV was (and is) a beautiful translation of God's Word into English.
2. No cardinal doctrine of Christianity is denied in the newer versions or the KJV.

[Brian McClurg]

NAMES AND TITLES OF JESUS OMITTED IN THE NIV
An asterisk (*) indicates that the NIV substituted
the title with an inferior one.

Matt. 8:29......................................Jesus

Matt. 9:28......................................Jesus

Matt. 13:36.....................................Jesus

Matt. 13:51......................................Lord

Matt. 15:30....................................Jesus'

Matt. 16:20.....................................Jesus

Matt. 17:20.....................................Jesus

Matt. 17:22.....................................Jesus

Matt. 18:2......................................Jesus

Matt. 18:11................................Son of man

Matt. 19:16..............................*Good Master

Matt. 23:8.....................................Christ

Matt. 23:10...................................*Master

Matt. 24:2......................................Jesus

Matt. 25:13................................Son of man

Matt. 27:24...............................just person

Matt. 28:6.......................................Lord

Mark 2:19..................................bridegroom

Mark 5:13.......................................Jesus

Mark 7:27.......................................Jesus

Mark 9:24........................................Lord

Mark 11:10.......................................Lord

Mark 11:14......................................Jesus

Mark 14:18......................................Jesus

Mark 14:45..........................master (or Rabbi)

Luke 4:41......................................Christ

Luke 7:22.......................................Jesus

Luke 7:31........................................Lord

Luke 9:35................................*beloved Son

Luke 9:56..................................Son of man

Luke 9:57........................................Lord

Luke 13:25.......................................Lord

Luke 17:6........................................Lord

Luke 22:31.......................................Lord

Luke 23:42.......................................Lord

John 4:16.......................................Jesus

John 4:42......................................Christ

John 4:46.......................................Jesus

John 6:69......................................Christ

John 6:69......................*Son of the Living God

John 8:20.......................................Jesus

John 8:35.....................................the Son

John 9:35.................................*Son of God

John 11:14......................................Jesus

John 11:39......................................Jesus

John 13:23......................................Jesus

John 19:38......................................Jesus

John 20:15......................................Jesus

John 21:5.......................................Jesus

John 21:21......................................Jesus

Acts 2:30......................................Christ

Acts 3:13....................................*his Son

Acts 3:23.....................................prophet

Acts 3:26....................................*his Son

Acts 3:26.......................................Jesus

Acts 4:27.................................*holy child

Acts 4:30.................................*holy child

Acts 7:30........................................Lord

Acts 8:37................................Jesus Christ

Acts 8:37..................................Son of God

Acts 9:5.........................................Lord

Acts 9:6.................................Lord (twice)

Acts 9:29.......................................Jesus

Acts 15:11.....................................Christ

Acts 15:18........................................God

Acts 16:31.....................................Christ

Acts 19:4......................................Christ

Acts 19:10......................................Jesus

Acts 20:21.....................................Christ

Acts 22:16.......................................Lord

Rom. 1:16......................................Christ

Rom. 6:11........................................Lord

Rom. 14:6........................................Lord

Rom. 15:8.......................................Jesus

Rom. 16:18......................................Jesus

Rom. 16:20.....................................Christ

Rom. 16:24..........................Lord Jesus Christ

I Cor. 5:4.............................Christ (twice)

I Cor. 5:5......................................Jesus

I Cor. 9:1.....................................Christ

I Cor. 9:18....................................Christ

I Cor. 10:28...................................Lord's

I Cor. 15:23.................................Christ's

I Cor. 15:47.....................................Lord

I Cor. 16:22.............................Jesus Christ

I Cor. 16:23...................................Christ

2 Cor. 4:6......................................Jesus

2 Cor. 4:10......................................Lord

2 Cor. 4:11.....................................Jesus

2 Cor. 5:18.....................................Jesus

2 Cor. 10:7..................................Christ's

2 Cor. 11:31...................................Christ

Gal. 3:17......................................Christ

Gal. 4:7.......................................Christ

Gal. 6:15................................Christ Jesus

Gal. 6:17........................................Lord

Eph. 3:9.................................Jesus Christ

Eph. 3:14...........................Lord Jesus Christ

Phil. 4:13.....................................Christ

Col. 1:2............................Lord Jesus Christ

Col. 1:28.......................................Jesus

I Thess. 1:1........................Lord Jesus Christ

I Thess. 2:19..................................Christ

I Thess. 3:11..................................Christ

I Thess. 3:13..................................Christ

2 Thess. 1:8...................................Christ

2 Thess. 1:12..................................Christ

I Tim. 1:1.......................................Lord

I Tim. 2:7.....................................Christ

I Tim. 3:16.......................................God

I Tim. 5:21......................................Lord

2 Tim. 4:1.......................................Lord

2 Tim. 4:22..............................Jesus Christ

Titus 1:4........................................Lord

Philem. 6.......................................Jesus

Heb. 3:1.......................................Christ

Heb. 10:30.......................................Lord

I Pet. 3:15......................................*God

I Pet. 5:10.....................................Jesus

I Pet. 5:14.....................................Jesus

I John 1:7.....................................Christ

I John 4:3.....................................Christ

I John 5:7...................................the Word

I John 5:13................................Son of God

2 John 3.........................................Lord

2 John 9.......................................Christ

Rev. 1:8.................the beginning and the ending

Rev. 1:9...............................Christ (twice)

Rev. 1:11.............................Alpha and Omega

Rev. 1:11......................the first and the last

Rev. 1:13.................................*Son of man

Rev. 12:17.....................................Christ

Rev. 14:14................................*Son of man

Rev. 20:12........................................God

Rev. 22:21.....................................Christ

[Knight]

Brian,

Enough. This is not the place for this debate. It is disrespectful to Mark for you to continue cutting and pasting things like this on his blog.

I realize that this discussion might have died out long ago had I not intervened and I apologize for that.

[David Doyle]

Does anyone know if the Local Church Bible Publishers is still a going concern? I've emailed twice with no response and today find that the phone has been disconnected.

[DavidT]

Brian,
Would you mind emailing me at davidt@yahoo.com? I have some questions for you, but I don't think this forum is the appropriate place to ask them.

[David Doyle]

Seems like Local Church Bible Publishers is ok. I found a way to get to them via the church number (why didn't I think of that before I posted?) and spoke to a very pleasant woman who said "we have an internet phone and we are having all kinds of trouble with it."

[Jeff Seymour]

Brian...I recant my apology of an earlier post. You just can't just leave well enough alone. You're right and everyone else (including Mark) is wrong. Well keep thinking that and see where it gets you.

[Matt Morales]

I missed the last ~10 or so posts on this thread and when I read it I busted up laughing.

Mark just posted "ON TRANSLATIONS" where one can go to discuss translations.

[Michael S. Swoveland]

Brian, I found your videos quite interesting. I would love to know more about adding the ribbon markers and changing the color of of leather on a Bible. Many thanks!

[Matthew]

As Chuck mentioned above, I too found that video most insightful. Here is a link to it....about half way down the page.

http://lcbplansing.org/Home/

[Aida]

I have just received Allan's Personal Size Reference ESV brown and it's beautiful.Very happy with my choice!

[Johnney O.]

Local Church Publishers make a wonderful bible that is of the highest quality binding. They make bibles for people that actually read and study the word of God. They make bibles that are practical and built for using.